Podcast episode
January 18, 2024
Episode 181: Macrobius and the Commentary on Scipio’s Dream
[Corrigendum: we mistakenly attribute Virgil’s famous ‘messianic’ passage to the Georgics; it is in fact to be found in the Fourth Eclogue.]
In this episode we try to sum up a very long and complex work of Latin Platonism perched at the end of antiquity and destined to have an outsize influence on the esoteric currents of the Far West in the middle ages: Macrobius’ Commentary on Cicero’s The Dream of Scipio. The layers of tradition, text, fictionality, and hermeneutical extravagance really take the cake with this one. But we try to cover the boring basics as well, discussing the evidence for who Macrobius might have been (late fourth-century, maybe a politician, but maybe not), what he wrote, what he believed, and what he was doing with his source-text, Cicero’s Dream. Following Macrobius’ digression-laden style, we also take this opportunity to introduce some side-alleys of lore, including a brief introduction to Cicero’s text, reflections on how Christian everyone really was in the late-fourth-century Latin-speaking Roman empire, discussion of the rise of the esoteric Virgil in late antiquity, and a number of other interesting side-alleys. we finish with a brief introduction to the unparalleled importance of Macrobius’ Commentary for the Latinate traditions of astronomy, astrology, ‘Pythagorean’ number, Platonist soul-theory, and more.
Works Cited in this Episode:
Primary:
Codex Theodosianus: references to various Macrobii: XVI.10.15; VIII.5.61 and XI.18.6; VI.8.1.
Libanius’s defense of the temples is Oration 30.
Macrobius:
Saturnalia: nos sub alio ortos cælo: præf. 11.
Comm. in somn. Scip: On narratio fabulosa and ancient sages: I.2.6-11. Physics and metaphysics: I.2.13-16. Arithmology: I.5.2-6.83. The descent of souls through the spheres: I.11.10-12. Planetary garments: I.12.13-14.
Virgil. The ‘messianic’ Fourth Eclogue (not Georgic, as we mistakenly said in the episode!). The gates of horn and ivory passage: Æneid VI 893–898.
Secondary:
Stahl 1952 [see below].
Henry 1934 [see below].
Lynn Thorndyke. A History of Magic and Experimental Science During the First Thirteen Centuries of our Era. Macmillan, New York, NY, 1923. 8 vols. We cite vol. I, p. 544.
Recommended Reading:
For a primary text we use Willis’ Teubner edition: James Alfred Willis, editor. Ambrosii Theodosii Macrobii Commentarii in Somnium Scipionis. Teubner, Leipzig, 1970. There is also Macrobe, Commentaire au songe du Scipion, texte établi, traduit et commenté par M. Armisen-Marchetti. Collection des Universités de France, Paris, 2001-2003. For an English translation we use Stahl 1952 (see below), which remains superb.
General
Pierre Courcelle. Les lettres grecques en occident de Macrobe a Cassiodore. Number 159 in Bibliothèque des ecoles françaises d’Athènes et de Rome. Paris, 1943.
Paul Henry. Plotin et l’occident; Firmicus Maternus, Marius Victorinus, Saint Augustin et Macrobe. Number 15 in Specilegium sacrum Lovaniense, études et documents. Louvain, 1934.
Karl Mras. Macrobius’ kommentar zu Ciceros somnium. Sitzungsberichte der preussischen Akademie der Wissenschaften, Philosophisch-historische Klasse, pages 232-86, 1933.
William Harris Stahl, editor. Commentary on the Dream of Scipio by Macrobius. Columbia University Press, New York, NY, 1952.
Occult Sciences in Macrobius, Various
Paul Capelle. De luna stellis lacteo orbe animarum sedibus. PhD thesis, Halle, 1917.
Adrian Mihai. L’Hadès céleste: Histoire du purgatoire dans l’antiquité. Classiques Garnier, Paris, 2015.
Karen ní Mheallaigh. The Moon in the Greek and Roman Imagination: Myth, Literature, Science and Philosophy. Greek Culture in the Roman World. The University Press, Cambridge, 2020, pp. 107-8, with the whole chapter.
F. E. Robbins. The Tradition of Greek Arithmology. Classical Philology, (16): 97-123, 1921.
Themes
Apophatic Writing, Astral Eschatology, Astral Influences, Astrology, Christianity, Divinisation, Dreams, Esoteric Christianity, Esoteric Hermeneutics, Esoteric Tradition, Macrobius, Marcus Tullius Cicero, Numenius of Apamea, Porphyry, Soul, Soul-Vehicle, Subtle Body, Virgil
Emily Stewart
January 20, 2024
I’m slightly embarrassed to admit I don’t know this offhand, but is it possible that the Milky Way intersected the ecliptic in Capricorn/Cancer at the time, but that it has since changed due to precession? or that it could be accounted for by the perfect 30° signs of the zodiac never having exactly lined up with the imperfectly variously-sized constellations (and they’re lining up less and less, again because of precession)?
Earl Fontainelle
January 20, 2024
Great question, Emily; I not only don’t know this offhand, but I’m hopeless with this astro-stuff all round. However, this passage was corrected by medieval commentators, so it’s not just a case of modern procession; it goes back at least a thousand years.
Does anyone know the answer to this one?
Håkon F. Teigen
January 28, 2024
I don’t know the answer to Emily’s question, unfortunately. Just wanted to point out that the same notion of the Milky Way as a path of the souls can be found in Manichaeism, where it seems to be derived from the Iranian concept of the Cinwad bridge .
Maziar Hashemi-Nezhad
February 1, 2024
Hello, The Milky Way as pathway of the souls in Manichean cosmology is fascinating. In regards to its original source, I, a none specialist, thus far haven’t come across any mention of the Milky Way in Avestan or Middle Persian sources. The only reference between the Milky Way and the Chinvat Bridge I have found is from late 19’th century by C.P. Tiele.
If you know of any primary sources or other information, I would appreciate it to know, cheers.
Håkon F. Teigen
February 2, 2024
Well, I am not a specialist on the Avestan or MP sources either, and so should have been more careful in my original post! But from working with Manichaean material, it seems clear that 1) the concept of the ‘Pillar of Glory’ can be equated with the Milky Way (as widely accepted by scholars), and 2) that it to a large extent is derived from the concept of the Chinwat bridge. That does not necessarily mean that the identification was already present in the Iranian context, and so care is needed, but there is some indirect evidence pointing in this direction which I hope to explore further.
Maziar Hashemi-Nezhad
January 31, 2024
As an amateur astronomer this is what I think:
In relation to the sun, the earth is tilted 23.4 degrees on its axis pointing towards the North Star, Polaris.
Axial precession will change the orientation of this tilt towards another part of the sky and in around 4,000 CE the star Errai (Gamma Cephei) will become the North Star. It is important to note that the earth’s tilt angle will still be 23.4 degrees. Furthermore, the path of the earth’s solar orbit will also not change. In other words, precession changes the orientation of the earth’s polar axis, it does not change the shape or relation of the earth’s orbit around the sun, the ecliptic.
The Earth and the rest of the planets continue to orbit the sun in a single plane (that’s why there is only a single ecliptic in the sky). Precession in the very long run will change the names of the months in relation to the seasons. It does not change the relation of the ecliptic to the rest of the Milky Way.
This means that our man Robi, really got it wrong and wasn’t as hip to the sky as he thought to be. For me it’s quite telling, all he had to do was to intermittently track the night sky for six months. It required him to look up and note in which constellation the planets are passing when they are transiting in the dense band of the Milky Way. He should have seen the constellation of Gemini and six months later Sagittarius (or vice versa), that’s it. Robi had no excuses, no telescope or any other instrumentation was required, for gods sake he only needed to have one eye. And don’t get me started on those inky pitch black dark skies of his time, the shear amount of celestial detail and stars would be staggering to us now. Skies that I and other amateur astronomers dream about from our ever so light polluted washed out modern skies, he had no excuses.