Podcast episode
February 25, 2018
Episode 25: The Esoteric Plato
Plato was known from late antiquity until quite modern times not as an esoteric author, but as the esoteric author. It was common knowledge that Plato hid his true meaning, and the hidden meanings readers have found in his work have been at the very heart of western esoteric thought. But nowadays Anglo-American scholars of Plato reckon that Plato wasn’t esoteric at all. We look at some of the history of Plato’s esoteric reception, some of the reasons why people have thought he was an esotericist, and the modern debate between Plato specialists over his supposed esotericism.
Along the way we define ‘esoteric’ and ‘Platonism’, both very important terms for our discussions, and ones which are, rather surprisingly, rarely defined in the scholarly literature which treats them. We also have a look at my idea of ‘esoteric reading’.
Esoteric Readers of Plato, Ancient and Modern, Cited in the Episode
Numenius fr. 23 des Places; Diogenes Laërtius 3. 63; Sallustius de de. et mun. III 4.11-15; Saint Augustine contra Ac. 3.37-43; Vico, p. 139; Leo Suavius, Theophrasti Paracelsi . . . p. 170, quoted at Walker 1975, 102; Taylor 1804, Vol. 3 p. 3; Casel 1919, p. 37; cf. 36-40; Strauss 1988; Burkert 1972, 19-20.
On The Modern Esotericist/Anti-Esotericist Debate
Friedrich Schleiermacher (1768-1834) is generally regarded as the first important breakaway from the esoteric reading of Plato, as you can see in his Introduction to the Dialogues (try page 9 ff.). For the twentieth-century debate, some key works (listed in full below) are:
- Anti-eso: Cherniss 1945; Vlastos 1963; Tigerstedt 1974.
- Eso: Krämer 1959; Gaiser 1963; Szlezák 1977, 1978a, 1978b, 1985.
Relevant Reading
- Burkert, W., 1972. Lore and Science in Ancient Pythagoreanism. Harvard University Press, Cambridge, MA.
- Casel, O., 1919. De philosophorum graecorum silentio mystico. A. Toepelmann, Giessen.
- Cherniss, H., 1945. The Riddle of the Early Academy. University of California Press, Berkeley, CA.
- Eggers, L. (1993). ‘Breve Introducción al Problema de las Ensenyazas Orales de Platôn’, Méthexis 6 : 1-11.
- Gaiser, K., 1963. Platons Ungeschriebene Lehre. Ernst Klett, Stuttgart.
- Gaiser, K. (1980). ‘Plato’s Enigmatic Lecture ‘On the Good”, Phronesis 25 : 5-37.
- Krämer, H. J., 1959. Arete bei Platon und Aristoteles: Zum Wesen und zur Geschichte der Platonischen Ontologie. Abhandlung d. Heidelberg. Akad. d. Wiss., Heidelberg.
- Strauss, L. 1975. The Argument and Action of Plato’s Laws. University of Chicago Press, Chicago, IL.
- Strauss, L., 1988. Persecution and the Art of Writing. University of Chicago Press, Chicago, IL.
- Szlezák, T. A. (1977). ‘Plotin und die Geheimen Lehren des Ammonios’. In: Holzhey, H. & Zimmerli, W. (Ed.), Esoterik und Exoterik in der Philosophie, Schwabe.
- Szlezák, T. A. (1978a). Dialogform und Esoterik. Zur Deutung des Platonischen Dialogs Phaidros, Museum Helveticum : 18-32.
- Szlezák, T. A. (1978b). ‘Probleme der Platoninterpretation’, Goettingische Gelehrte Anzeigen : 1-37.
- Szlezák, T. A., 1985. Platon und die Schriftlichkeit der Philosophie: Interpretationen zu den frühen und mittleren Dialogen. De Gruyter, Berlin/New York, NY.
- Taylor, T., 1804. The Works of Plato. R. Wilks, London.
- Tigerstedt, E., 1974. The Rise and Fall of the Neoplatonic Reading of Plato. Societas Scientiarum Fennica, Helsinki/Helsingfors.
- Vico, G., 1963. Autobiography. Cornell University Press, Ithaca, NY.
- Vlastos, G. (1963). ‘On Plato’s Oral Doctrine. Review of H.W. Krämer, Arete bei Platon und Aristoteles‘, 1959, Gnomon 35 : 641-655.
- Vlastos, G., 1981. Platonic Studies. Princeton University Press, Princeton, NJ.
- Walker, D. P., 1975. Spiritual and Demonic Magic from Ficino to Campanella. University of Notre Dame Press, London.
Johannes Drever
November 26, 2019
The relevant reading list mentions the autobiography by Giambattista Vico. Is he mentioned in the episode? I’m asking because Vico is often cited as a predecessor to radical constructivism.
Earl Fontainelle
November 26, 2019
Yes, he’s in there, under the list of ‘well-known people who read Plato as an esoteric writer’.
Craig Brewer
October 21, 2020
I went to grad school for philosophy back in the day, and though I never focused intently on the ancients at the time, I was struck by one of my professor’s books on Plato: _Being and Logos_ by John Sallis. It stressed the narrative and dramatic contexts above all else. I’m just curious if that’s at all a book that is still “read” as part of the discussion anymore…and he was primarily a Heideggerian, so I’m quite sure it’s not part of strict analytic conversations.
Saeeduddin Ahmed
April 22, 2022
Well, it’s available for Kindle (I have mixed feelings about the Amazon enterprise, but it’s good in that titles like this are so easily accessible)
The intro paragraph seems to imply that similar questions will be explored in the book as are in Earl’s podcasts
https://i.imgur.com/sJHn4Pn.png
Craig Brewer
April 27, 2022
Definitely! That’s why I was wondering, but I was also just curious how far that book’s influence went beyond the little circle of continental types. I certainly think Earl should read it if he hasn’t. heh heh Thanks for looking it up!
Calliope Irving
October 28, 2021
Really appreciate all your work and the way in which it is issued to us.
Earl Fontainelle
July 4, 2022
I appreciate your appreciation!
Saeeduddin Ahmed
April 22, 2022
I finally listened to this episode (I haven’t been going in order; but it seemed critical to go back here to have any chance of understanding the context for the current episodes focusing on Iamblichus).
Plato’s 7th letter struck me. I must say, not specializing in this area, I hadn’t heard of this before. Here then is a list of links that I found exploring this online today
There are several available English translations (online) from the 20th and 21st century :
-1928: http://classics.mit.edu/Plato/seventh_letter.html
-1966: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0164%3Aletter%3D7
-2019: https://www.academia.edu/38569095/Translation_of_Platos_Seventh_Letter
Some recent scholarship is in this book: https://www.amazon.com/Plato-Syracuse-Western-translation-Heritage-ebook/dp/B07P5ZBW17/
(which has a good amount available in the Amazon “look inside” preview)
https://i.imgur.com/qSaVOfU.png
The authenticity is still a bit of question (as the materials linked just below show):
https://histos.org/documents/2016RD08TrapponFredeBurnyeat.pdf
https://www.repository.cam.ac.uk/bitstream/handle/1810/267017/The_Seventh_LetterA_Discussion_of_Myles_Burnyeat_and_Michael_Frede_The_PseudoPlatonic_Seventh_Letter%20%281%29.pdf?sequence=3&isAllowed=y
I also discovered the notion of “Quincunxes”
https://philarchive.org/archive/LOSPQ
In the 7th letter, a particular Quindunx is mentioned:
“This fivefold distinction first of all consists of three basic parts that together make up a fourth, which is called knowledge (ἐπιστήμη, 342a).11 The three basic parts are the name (ὄνομα), the account (λόγος)12 and the image (εἴδωλον, 342a-b). Besides these four, so to
speak, epistemological factors, the writer also discerns a fifth, ontological, which is at first described as ‘that which is graspable and true”
http://ensani.ir/file/download/article/20120507102029-9055-58.pdf
I also came across the marvelous Giovanni Reale (unfortunately now deceased). He is the subject of this review (the book reviewed is available for download online on slightly disreputable websites, or can be purchases in hardcopy): https://bmcr.brynmawr.edu/1998/1998.07.22/
Of note:
“The starting points of the esoteric approach are the “criticism of writing” in the Phaedrus and the Seventh Letter as well as representations of Plato’s doctrines in later ancient authors such as Aristotle, Aristoxenus, Alexander of Aphrodisias, Simplicius, Sextus Empiricus and others. Their remarks are called “indirect tradition” as opposed to the “direct tradition” of Plato’s philosophy in the dialogues”
Lastly, I found what might be an interesting course to take at Fordham University:
https://faculty.fordham.edu/klima/phru1000/PHRU1000reader.pdf#page21
Earl Fontainelle
May 3, 2022
Thanks for all the links, and for mentioning Reale. He should definitely be included in the ‘Relevant Reading’ section to this episode, as probably the main non-Tübingen member of the ‘Tübingenschule’. His esoteric reading of Plato has been very influential, and passing him over in silence is just me being sloppy.